Public discussion on Roman Republic corporate bylaw reform

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Public discussion on Roman Republic corporate bylaw reform

Postby Tiberius Terentius Varro » Fri Dec 01, 2017 10:59 pm

Salvete!

I see that the Comitia Curiata is quietly meeting to discuss reforming the governing document of the corporate arm of the Republic. The corporation is the public face of our community and is responsible for its assets.

I am interested to see if our community has any thoughts about the proposed changes. Read more at this link.

The current bylaws are visible | http://www.romanrepublic.org/wip/Roman% ... _final.pdf
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Re: Public discussion on Roman Republic corporate bylaw reform

Postby Gaius Florius Lupus » Sat Dec 02, 2017 5:09 pm

Salvete Quirites!
I think this amendment is generally a good idea.
But in principle I reject the interpretation that the corporation is in the position to regulate our community. The corporation s just a tool, and the majority of our cives do not fall under Canadian jurisdiction.
valete!
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Re: Public discussion on Roman Republic corporate bylaw reform

Postby Lucius Aurelius Curio » Sat Dec 02, 2017 5:59 pm

Curio Sal.

As the individual chairing the current session of the Comitia Curiata, I will offer this on the bylaw changes. This request of changes came from a lex proposed by our current Praetor, M. Flavius Celsus. This lex would allow for minors to become part of our Republic. However, it had to be turned down currently as the bylaws contradicted them by not allowing for any citizen below 18 years of age to join.

Many of our members have children. This bylaw change would allow them to join with permission from their parent(s). This will help us educate and cultivate future generations of Romans to come.

I hope this helps clarify the bylaw change we are currently discussing.

Valete Bene!

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Re: Public discussion on Roman Republic corporate bylaw reform

Postby Publius Sextius Laevus » Sun Dec 03, 2017 4:56 pm

Salvete Cives Urbis et Orbis

I support this change. Not only for the children of the current citizens, but also for all those who, with a keen interest in Roman history, Culture or Latin, will get their parent to join so as to allow them to become part of our Republic. Many of us coming to the Republic as adults are reviving the interest in Roman history we had while still in school in the third quarter of the last century. Would that we had had such an opportunity (OK... would that we had had the internet...).

This change does place the onus of implementation back in the Senate. The needs and protections of all (children, adults, corporation) must be addressed there. There is the question http://www.romanrepublic.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=2006 of what Forum web site access restrictions are technically possible.

Although the RR NFP corporation is founded in Canada, we are an international community and as such, we, as individuals and as a corpoation, are subject to laws on many levels. Caveat aranea peregrinans.

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Re: Public discussion on Roman Republic corporate bylaw reform

Postby Gaius Florius Lupus » Sun Dec 03, 2017 11:33 pm

The Republic is not the corporation.
I am neither Canadian citizej nor a resident of Canada nor an employee or kffifer of this corporation. So how do I fall under Canadian jurisdiction?
I think there is a misunderstanding how international law works.
The citizens of the Repuhlic are not legally part of the corporation.
And the Republic is not bound by the corporate bylaws, only the lictores and magistrates are.
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Re: Public discussion on Roman Republic corporate bylaw reform

Postby Lucius Livius Seneca » Mon Dec 04, 2017 12:04 am

L. Livius quaest. cons. C. Florio sal.

Gaius Florius Lupus wrote:The citizens of the Republic are not legally part of the corporation.

Not quite. All citizens who are not also lictors are non-voting members of the corporation, and as such, are subject to its bylaws as applicable, for example Section 15, "Discipline of Members," or Section 37, "Dispute Resolution."

As for the matter of jurisdiction, the question isn't as straightforward as you might think, especially on the internet, as well as in Canadian law.

Vale.
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Re: Public discussion on Roman Republic corporate bylaw reform

Postby Lucius Aurelius Curio » Mon Dec 04, 2017 12:35 am

Curio Sal.

International corporations determine it's members by its membership in the corporation. By registering as Class: Citizen (A citizen of the RR), you are a non voting (on corporate matters) member of the corporation. This is how non profit corporations work. Every citizen is classified as a member of the corporation by registering.

For instance, approval of all citizens is done by the Censores. However, this responsibility is given to the Censores by the corporation. Or else it'd be the Lictores that are approving all citizens, not the Censores. This is done so the Class: Citizens have a fair say on who is given this enormous responsibility to approve or deny membership by voting these individuals into office.

I hope this helped clear things up.

Valete Bene!

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Re: Public discussion on Roman Republic corporate bylaw reform

Postby Gaius Florius Lupus » Mon Dec 04, 2017 1:53 am

Salvete!

Maybe I should explain myself a little bit better by an example.
On November 14 our Senate passed Lex Flavia about the establishment of a Roman Army paving the way for Legio XI Claudia Pia Fidelis which operates in Sarmatia.
So if Canada passes a law that bans carrying replicas of a gladius, does this affect our corporation? - Yes, it does.
Does it affect the members of the Legio XI Claudia? - Certainly not. They are citizens of the Republic but not under Canadian jurisdiction.

Furthermore I would like to show that the assumption that all citizens are non-voting members of the corporation is legally dangerous, because it violates the laws of several countries, of which our cives are citizens. Many countries either do not allow foreign corporations to operate in their territory, which is why huge international corporations are required to constitute local branches under local law. or they require a formal registration.
Back to our example of Legio XI Claudia. If the members of this legion are also members of our Canadian corporation, then they violate the "Foreign Agent Law" (Bill 102766-6) of the Russian Federation enacted in 2012 that regulates NGOs. Non-profit organizations that receive foreign donations are required to register in Russia as Foreign Agents, which is a very complicated process.
If we maintain the notion that all citizens of the Republic are members of a Canadian non-profit corporation, then we are committing a serious violation of Russian law.

I have joined this forum even before the corporation was created (February 26, 2016) and I have always opposed the establishment of this corporation, and I am not the only one.
We are not subject to any Canadian NGO,. only the assets of our Republic belong to this corporation, not the cives.
We, the Republic can decide whatever we want who can join our community. We do not need an amendment of the corporate bylaws. It is obvious that minors under 18 cannot be elected into any office and should also be excluded from the right to vote. But this is as far as it goes.
It is the Republic, not the corporation that decides whether or not minors can become members.

The only function of this corporation is the legal protection of our assets. And it ends right here. The corporation should not try to interfere in politics. The corporation may enact bylaws about our assets, but not about our citizens or decide who can become a citizen or not.

We are not members of the corporation. Whoever claims so, violates the national laws of several countries, among those the Russian Federation.
No internationally operating company can operate like this, just be constituted in one country and then do what they like in all countries they operate.

The bylaws reform is good, but it is irrelevant for our Republic. We can allow to join whomever we want. We do not need the permission of a Canadian corporation for that.

Valete!
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Re: Public discussion on Roman Republic corporate bylaw reform

Postby Tiberia Salvia Alba » Tue Dec 05, 2017 10:00 am

Надеюсь я правильно поняла Gaius Florius Lupus, и гугл-переводчик правильно перевел его слова. Если так, то я вынуждена частично согласиться с Gaius Florius Lupus. Да, у 11го Легиона есть проблемы в связи с тем, что главная организация находится зарубежом. Так было когда мы состояли в Nova Roma. Но эта организация, Nova Roma, нас жестоко предала, подставила. Мы выучили этот горький урок и сделали нужные выводы. Так что в отличии от Nova Roma, в отношениях с Римской Республикой мы используем другую схему отношений. Сейчас у нас нет никаких проблем. Но я с трудом могу объяснить юридическую суть этого вопроса. По этому поводу лучше объяснит, он - наш юрист.
Конкретно сейчас для Великой Сарматии не имеет никакого значения зарегистрирована Римская Республика как юридическое лицо в какой стране. Я занимаюсь финансами Провинции. И я понимаю, что для будущего Римской Республики, когда он станет больше, понадобиться регистрация в качестве юридического лица, иначе счета, интернет ресурсы, и другие общие вещи будут в руках одного человека, что поставит под угрозу Республику. Я видела, как это уничтожило Nova Roma. Я не хочу повторения.
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Re: Public discussion on Roman Republic corporate bylaw reform

Postby Publius Iunius Brutus » Tue Dec 05, 2017 6:17 pm

Translation of above post from Quaestor Salvia:

I hope I understood Gaius Florius Lupus correctly, and the Google translator correctly translated his words. If so, then I have to partially agree with Gaius Florius Lupus. Yes, the 11th Legion has problems due to the fact that the main organization is abroad. So it was when we were in Nova Roma. But this organization, Nova Roma, cruelly betrayed us, framed us. We learned this bitter lesson and made the necessary conclusions. So unlike Nova Roma, in relations with the Roman Republic we use a different relationship scheme. Now we do not have any problems. But I can hardly explain the legal essence of this issue. On this occasion he will better explain, he is our lawyer.
It is now for the Great Sarmatia does not matter, the Roman Republic is registered as a legal entity in which country. I deal with the finances of the Province. And I understand that for the future of the Republic of Rome, when it becomes bigger, it will be necessary to register as a legal entity, otherwise accounts, Internet resources, and other common things will be in the hands of one person, which will jeopardize the Republic. I saw how it destroyed Nova Roma. I do not want to repeat.
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