On Maecenas and Cassia - My Failures

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Re: On Maecenas and Cassia - My Failures

Postby Octavia Aurelia Fulva » Sat Apr 15, 2017 10:53 pm

Salvete!

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but so far seems this was a personal problem between two adults and responsible citizens that crossed the limit line going from something private between them to something that suddenly is a public matter because of their behavior.
They took their decision and I respect it because will be a big lack of seriousness that after such an important step done, any of them change their mind. I think we all are grown up here and I trust both had a good reason to resign as citizens (as was shortly explained).

It makes me feel a bit sad to see them leave but what makes me sadder it is this kind of things happening in a community like Roman Republic. Keep tragedy in Greece, please.

My best wishes to Curtius Philo and hope your health will be restored the sooner possible.
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Re: On Maecenas and Cassia - My Failures

Postby Lucius Aurelius Curio » Sun Apr 16, 2017 5:03 am

Curio Lupo Sal.

As always, a very interesting take on events occurring. I will say this, before going any further, this isn't a failing of our government. This was a private disagreement that started out having nothing to do with our organization. This was a butting of heads between two people of differing political extremes.

That being said, I was personally asked by Cassia to intercede on her behalf to 'make' Maecenas stop posting alt right material to his own Facebook page. I did not take that action, as censorship as a whole does not sit right with me. Even if I had wanted to, I wouldn't have had the grounds to stand on to even do such a thing. This being said, Cassia left because she felt we failed her by not intercepting this, and that by doing so we condoned his views.

I will say this to everyone here. I will never stand for censorship, as that is not what the Roman Republic is. We are not here to control or censor anyone for holding opposing views. We are a place for all who identify as Romans, no matter what their race, religion, gender or creed. Rome was a melting pot of tolerance, and I believe we should be so as well.

Behavior between the two escalated to such a measure that it reflected poorly on our organization, especially when Cassia outright called him 'non-Roman' for his views, and he would never be a Roman. On top of this she leveled accusations of fascism and him being a neo nazi.

The Roman Republic got involved only after a complaint from Maecenas was brought to us. Her accusations of fascism and being a neo Nazi are considered grounds of character defamation. However, their behavior (Cassia as Aedile and Maecenas as a Tribunus Laticlavius representing a Consul of the Roman Republic) was found to not be in line with our Mos Maiorum. As such, our Censor P. Iunius Brutus issued a Nota against Maecenas for his behavior. As per this Nota, he lost his Optimo Iure status, which is needed to continue on as an assistant in any role in our Republic. Therefore, I was forced to dismiss him as Tribunus Laticlavius. Maecenas resigned after he realized the damage that his behavior had caused overall. This was an honorable and virtuous thing for him to do.

Cassia did not receive a Nota as she resigned before we intervened. If she had remained a citizen, she would have received the same Nota that Maecenas received. So this fault doesn't rest on the shoulders of the Republic, but on two people of differing political views. What should have been a private matter turned into a public one amidst heated words and slung accusations of character.

Vale Bene!

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Re: On Maecenas and Cassia - My Failures

Postby Lucia Horatia Adamas » Sun Apr 16, 2017 7:25 am



L. Horatia Adamas P. Junio Bruto C. Florio Lupo omnibus bonae voluntatis S.P.D.

As is the case with Lupus, I had no idea that all of this was going on behind our backs. Perhaps these shocking developments occurred when both of us, and probably others, were not receiving copies of the digest, thus had no knowledge of them. Surely it is a sad thing when valuable members leave an organization, whatever their reasons, but the organization will recover, although that may take some time. The same has occurred with other organizations. There will always be disagreements, political or otherwise, and from what has been written here on this subject, this one got far out of hand. At the very least, a cooling off period would be a good idea.

My best wishes for the speedy recovery of Consul Philo, who in no way is responsible for this unfortunate situation.

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Re: On Maecenas and Cassia - My Failures

Postby Tiberius Publicius Gracchus » Sun Apr 16, 2017 8:30 am

I disagreed with Maecenas on some issues but still found his contributions to the discussion to be informative and well researched. Cassia was also a very knowlegable member of this Republic and I will miss discussing philosophy with her. I have decided that I will not let politics come between me and any other member of this Republic. I am opinionated, but we are all Romans.
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Re: On Maecenas and Cassia - My Failures

Postby Lucius Metilius Niger » Sun Apr 16, 2017 7:07 pm

Tiberius Publicius Gracchus wrote: we are all Romans.


YES we are all Romans, we are the Populum
WE are the "Nation" :D
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Re: On Maecenas and Cassia - My Failures

Postby Publius Iunius Brutus » Sun Apr 16, 2017 11:22 pm

Lucia Horatia Adamas wrote:L. Horatia Adamas P. Junio Bruto C. Florio Lupo omnibus bonae voluntatis S.P.D.

As is the case with Lupus, I had no idea that all of this was going on behind our backs. Perhaps these shocking developments occurred when both of us, and probably others, were not receiving copies of the digest, thus had no knowledge of them. Surely it is a sad thing when valuable members leave an organization, whatever their reasons, but the organization will recover, although that may take some time. The same has occurred with other organizations. There will always be disagreements, political or otherwise, and from what has been written here on this subject, this one got far out of hand. At the very least, a cooling off period would be a good idea.

My best wishes for the speedy recovery of Consul Philo, who in no way is responsible for this unfortunate situation.

Valete.



Salve Amica!

All this bickering occurred in Facebook. That's why you missed it. Count yourself lucky. It was tedious to watch.

For those who are interested in more off topic conversation the RR has a Facebook group with over 3300 members. It buzzes with activity. But you need to sort through an assortment of posts to find things you may find personally relevant. I much favor this forum. But both have their purposes.

If interested here is the Facebook group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/1529033420760841/

Cultores have their own group here as well, it has about 1000 members: https://www.facebook.com/groups/1734542313473725/
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Re: On Maecenas and Cassia - My Failures

Postby Gaius Florius Lupus » Mon Apr 17, 2017 2:48 am

Gratias vobis ago, Curio et Brute!
This was some very helpful explanation of the events.

Honestly I have to say, I do not understand Cassia an Maecenas. Consul, you did exactly what was right and appropriate.
But it is so sad that we lost Cassia Longina. She has done so much for our Republic. She will leave a big loss behind. But given the situation I have no idea what we could do to change her mind. That she left the Republic after all the effort she had put into it, simply makes no sense.
I have not received an answer to my e-mail to her. Unfortunately I do not have the e-mail address of Maecenas, so I cannot contact him to convince him to reconsider his resignation.
It looks like some people with the highest motivation have also the most difficult personality (thinking about Marcus Audens in this context).

Well, we have to go on without them, but they will be difficult to replace.
Do we have any other citizen living in Rome, now that Cassia is gone?

Valete amici!
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Re: On Maecenas and Cassia - My Failures

Postby Lucius Metilius Niger » Mon Apr 17, 2017 10:09 am

Gaius Florius Lupus wrote:it is so sad that we lost Cassia Longina.
Agreed.
I think you have to ask her to reconsider his resignation it's a great loss for the RR
she could be a very important contact between RR and CPR at Rome Italy.
without her, the US/European partnership could be impossible.
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Re: On Maecenas and Cassia - My Failures

Postby Gaius Florius Lupus » Mon Apr 17, 2017 12:23 pm

Ita est, Metili Niger! She was our link to the CPR. This was one of the things why she was so important.
Do we have anybody else here who is also member of the Communitas Populi Romani?
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Re: On Maecenas and Cassia - My Failures

Postby Lucius Metilius Niger » Mon Apr 17, 2017 1:23 pm

Cassia isn't a CPR member, but she's just sympathizing I think. Like me and french cultores actually.
wathever it's very precious on my point of view, because if CPR people could be friends with RR people it could be a real chance to optimize the global cooperation of cultores in the world.
it's what I expect and hope for the future, and it's the reason why I'm here, despite my opinions regarding virtual republics and their limits.
Our similiarities are most important than our differences. We are the "Nation", the ResPublica Romana is nothing without the Roman People
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